Interview With A Man Who Never Moves Into the Middle of the Train (Bastardo!)

you know 'em. I know 'em. When will these people not exist? Here's the interview:

TAN: So have you ever ridden in the middle of the car?

Stupid Man: No, actually I haven’t. It looks so scary and dangerous.

TAN: There are millions who ride in the middle of the subway car every day. What gives you such reason for pause?

Stupid Man: Well you never heard the story?

TAN: What story?

Stupid Man: The story about the man and daughter who rode in the middle of the subway car.

TAN: Um, no actually. Haven’t heard that story. Please tell us.

Stupid Man: Ok. I will..... but please stop calling me "stupid man."

TAN: Tell your story, or I will destroy you, punk.

Punk: fine...

~~~~
scene dissolve …
~~~~

We open inside of a NYC subway car. It is crowded, but there is an even distribution of people throughout the car. We close in on a father and daughter standing and talking in the middle of the car. The father is explaining to his daughter why thinking about others and being respectful is the thing to do. Being considerate. Being a nice person. Being aware. All good. We zoom in and listen in on their conversation:

For example, honey. You know when we cross the street, and how all the cars wait for us to pass? That is because they are being respectful of others. Theoretically. You remember that word, right honey? Thee-o-ret-ick-ally. Well theoretically, those cars could just fly straight at us and run us over and kill us.

Kill us daddy?

Yes, honey. Kill us. But because they are nice and respectful of others. And because we made laws. We get to cross the street safe and sound, and then go home and eat ice cream!!!

I like ice cream! Thee-o-ret-ick-ally.

No, honey. I think you definitely like ice cream.

Race, Religion, & Rapture

(THERE'S NOT MUCH TIME LEFT, THIS 2008 INTERVIEW WITH DANIEL RADOSH ABOUT "RAPTURE READY" HAS NEVER BEEN MORE RELEVANT. MAKE SURE IT'S AMONG THE LAST THINGS YOU READ BEFORE, WELL, YOU KNOW...)

ORIGINAL:

This is an interview about Christian pop culture...

Wait! Don't go yet! The power of Obama compels you!

See, these days with reverends calling out future presidents, and future presidents giving dap like they're chilling at the 40/40 club, the tides of race, religion and pop culture have washed us all up on some sort of unchartered island. Everyone's a little Lost for clear definitions: What does it mean to be black? What does it mean to be Christian? What does it mean to be Tyler Perry?

So here's the deal: Daniel Radosh -- one of the smartest Caucasians I know (statement verifiable by his blog: Radosh.net) -- immersed himself in the mostly white-washed world of Christian pop culture for 12 months. And he survived to tell the story! Annnd that story is available for purchase at your local book store, Rapture Ready!.

Intrigued by how this seeming societal outlier could be a 7-billion dollar a year industry, I emailed Daniel a bunch of questions looking for connections between issues of race and Christian evangelicals. Basically trying to keep it "Spiritual, but not Religious", so we can get more perspective on if those folks are "Christian, but not Crazy."

In so doing we explored why church at 11AM is still the most segregated time in America, and why Jesus "can be your girlfriend, but not your ho", all set-up so that I could pin him down on one question: would he rather wake up as an evangelical christian, or a black person?

Will Daniel provide some compelling data to help us navigate this dark island of cultural politics, or will he say something inflammatory or insensitive? Find out in the interview below:


TAN Interviews Writer Daniel Radosh [EbonyJet]

Interview with a 27 Year Old Virgin

The virgin contained in this interview is REAL (also 27, female, and caucasian). Her virginity was not harmed during the course of the interview. 

So let's get the movie out of the way: 40 year old virgin, do you own it? How long? What does it mean to you? 

I've seen the movie, but don't own it. I'd rate it somewhere above Talladega Nights but below Anchorman. 

Do you like the movie more because of you sharing the story? Or less? Like if I was on La Amistad, or any slave ship, and then I watched Amistad, I could see finding it annoying ... 

Here's the misconception: all virgins are not the same. Never have I tried to lose my virginity and failed to do so. 

If the story were more like your story, in terms of it being a younger girl, would it be better or lamer? Might you become a 40-year-old virgin? 

I don't think I'd let myself make it to 40. I'm looking for love, so hopefully love will come before 40.

So who else knows The Secret? 

Well, pretty soon all of your readers. Other than that, most of my girlfriends, a handful of my guy friends, and a few guys who have broken up with me because of it. ;) 

Which do you feel more often: 1. I want to tell the world! 2. I wish no one knew about this. 

I've never wanted to tell the world...hence the promise of anonymity in exchange for this interview. 

Are you attractive? Please try and convey your attractiveness in some way so people can know if your virginity is just a symptom of being ugly. 

How do I say yes without sounding like a bitch? It's like saying I'm a virgin without sounding like a prude.  

Have you ever talked to your pootie-tang? You and her are kind of going through this together, so it seems to me that at a certain age it would be weird if you hadn't talked to her. Like at some point YOU MUST have the exchange where you say, "well kitty cat, it looks like it's just you and me tonight..." and then your poochie goes into hysterics, or falls out laughing or whatever. 

My vag has never fallen out, laughing or otherwise. But I think this is where guys and girls differ...we don't name cars or our cha-cha's. And we certainly don't talk to them. At least, I don't anyway. 

How is the "virgin cachet?" I could see it becoming the ironically cool alternative hipster thing to do. Do you ever feel like, "boy, I remember when slutty whores were all the rage -- in the 90s or whatever -- but now "virgins" are the new "slutty whores."? 

Eh - I don't think anyone sees it as the "ironically cool alternative hipster thing" to do. However, most people (women, anyway) have found it admirable. Or maybe that's just because they're my friends and don't want to say anything mean. 

Do your fantasies have people in them? or are they all like movie reenactments? Fantasies are usually some sort of creative amalgam of sexual things you've seen or experienced. But you know only movie sex, right? I imagine your fantasies are like some mashup of your top 5 movie sex scenes ... 

I'm not a fucking corpse, TAN. I'm also not retarded. I know what goes on in the bedroom, and have enjoyed a lot of the things I've done in there. So I can fantasize about that AND movie stars - a creative amalgam of sexual things I've seen and experienced. 

How can you fantasize about sex if you haven't experienced it? I remember having fantasies about all sorts of things before I tried them, but when I tried it was totally different. Do you think, for example, sex is like flying a space shuttle? 

No. I don't imagine sex is anything like flying a space shuttle. 

I'm presuming there have been attempts, could you tell us what happened on the closest attempt? 

I'm afraid I won't be explaining the details of the closest attempts, but there have been a few. 

Are there particular boys or incidents you regret, or scenarios where you wished you were more aggressive? 

I'm constantly wondering if guys would have stuck around longer had I given in earlier - but then I ask myself if I want to be with someone who'd take off so soon just because I wouldn't sleep with him. And for the record, I constantly go back and forth when answering myself. 

Do you think virgins garner the proper amount of respect on the social totem pole? Let me explain: For example, when I think of virgins I think about how little I would care for any advice they have to offer on sex/sex relationships. Say we're hanging out, and I just started dating a girl and we're getting along and I'm wondering about rushing into sex or holding out for fear of crash-and-burning, they might have an opinion but does it matter? They'd say something and I'd laugh and say, awww, that's cute. So: Do you think virgins have anything to offer a conversation largely about sexual relationships? Or a world rife with sexual politics? 

I've actually experienced you're dismissal of anything I have to say in the sex department, so I know exactly how little you care and how cute you think it is, thanks. But you do have a point, there isn't a lot a virgin can offer when it comes to discussing the act of sex or, for that matter, the way it can change the dynamic of a relationship. All we can do is listen to your wise, wise words. But I think a virgin can offer something about the benefits of waiting and, let's face it, every argument needs to be countered. So that's how you sluts can benefit from our point of view. 

Are you happy, regretful, anxious to be in your position? 

Sometimes I'm happy, sometimes I'm anxious. But I can definitively say I've never been regretful. 

Do you think you're missing out on life? you've had to consider the possibility that the whole point of life is sex, right? Reproducing the species. How do you live with doing the one thing we were born to do? 

One of the reasons that I'm waiting is because I don't think that sex is life (Calm down...breathe. I'm aware that you disagree with me on this). I've had a great life without sex and I want to have great relationships that aren't based solely on sex. Do I think sex is important? Yea, but I want to share it with the right person (cue end-of-family sitcom "life lesson" music). Cheesy? Maybe, but I'm fine with that. 

What's your ideal de-flowering? do you even think of yourself as a flower? 

I don't think of myself as a flower. And my ideal de-virginizing has changed so much over the years. I've totally over-romanticized it at certain times, of course, but I've come to focus more on the person than the setting. Besides, if I try too hard to make it perfect, I'll only end up being disappointed. 

In general, do you think you'd rather meet a virgin boy, or Mr. Experienced-but-sensitive ....? 

I go back and forth with this one, too. But as of this minute, I want Mr. Experienced and sensitive ... is that hypocritical? Eh. 

How old do you think you need to be before you'd just rape someone to get it over with. Or at least be really non-discerning. Could you die a virgin? 

I really don't think I'd ever be non-discerning. Worst-case scenario, I'd grab one of my closest guy friends and be like, dude, do me. Talk about romantic. 

Awww, I'll be your friend, V. Thanks for the interview ...

Have I Ventured to the Dark Side?: I'm Sad Sasha Finds Me Belittling, and Her Fans Will Hate Me

My interview with Sasha Grey is a little bit controversial. At least for me.

I'm sure Sasha Grey is lovely when you get to know her. But there's a part in The Girlfriend Experience where the journalist asks about her "wall" and if/when it comes down, and if most people get to see the "real" her. Sasha's character, a character in large part based on her "character" in real life, says probably not. Vanessa G in the Rolling Stone piece likened the feeling to a woman behind glass. If you read the many interviews both print and video online, you'll find inaccessibility to be a theme.

My interview doesn't intend to begrudge Sasha that wall. It makes sense to have a wall up for a number of reasons. My dilemma was simple: I don't want to trot out the same boring interview everyone else is. And I asked questions, a month ago, that would hopefully find some new territory. Of course in an email interview you have to go through a little bit of old territory to get there.

Point being, I approached this as an opportunity for an interesting conversation. This is how I've approached all my hot-ass interviews. I am not "belittling" her (another word Sasha has thrown at interviewers before, I'm not the first to belittle unknowingly), and to my mind they are the same questions I would ask any writers, artists, creative professionals. Yes, I wouldn't ask someone in a different industry about "how to identify a fucking genius", but I would ask any professional about the 10,000 hours, and what constitutes superlative achievement/talent in their field.

When I interviewed Jeff Chang, the questions were equally chunky with verbiage (this is how I approach the issue of miscommunication, missed tone in email interviews, by rephrasing the question a bunch and they choose the one which connects), and also numerous (I trimmed down the initial question list a couple times, to make it more manageable), but he also has no reason to be distrustful of media and indulged the spirit of the conversation.

There's the "seduced over email" question. As the first question, it seems an obvious warm-up to me. Every single female who goes on Late Show with Conan or Letterman gets a flirty question thrown at them. Ignoring the "commentary on our sexist society" aspect, it's mostly functional. All serving as an easy way to gauge the temperature, figure out the mood/tone of your interviewee etc.. If she's fun and flirty, you might go with it. If not, you move on. If the interview were with a basketball player you'd make a softball corny open about maybe playing a pickup game or something. Same idea.

Back to the original dilemma: an interesting interview. I think some people are into doing them, some are not. No one's going to do an interesting interview with Robert Deniro (well, except a close friend maybe) because he's not interested. I feel a little bad that this would give Sasha more fuel for her distrust of media. But my spirit was pure and true! Sasha herself trumpets individualism, not being boring, so what am I to do when she gives me a boring interview. Interviews can be art. Anything can be if you choose to approach it as such. Belittling presumes I'm trying to get over on you, but what if I'm just practicing my trade as best I can? From her side, if she's doing a million interviews it's easy see me as another dude trying to service his media master. But I did put work into this, and am trying to make all my interviews part of a larger more artful TAN complex. She doesn't need to know or care about that, but to write me off could be seen as belittling.

The ambition in this blog-post-interview was to connect a theme from the movie, the hype-media publicity machine, and my particular interview. There's this whole dichotomy of veiled mystique and unobtainable intimacy. And I found the most interesting part of our Interview Experience to be how it reflected The Girlfriend Experience. Again, everyone is trying to get their hand on or around the wall. With varying degrees of success. Whatever.

Anyways, I had that sitting on my chest and had to get it out somewhere. I think the gawker commenters are shading something that is not ostensibly mean as such. And I'm just defending my position. Cheers!

The Sasha Grey Interview Experience [Gawker]

image: via

Post-Hype: Christian Lander (Stuff White People Like)

After the mobs go away, I'm the only one who still cares...

That's not true, but I kind of wish that were the salacious smarmy tagline for this interview series premised on a simple idea: much better to talk to people after the hype cycle has buzzed on.

When I first interviewed Christian Lander, few knew his name: the L.A. Times was breaking the "who's behind the blog-sensation 'Stuff White People Like'" story the same day as me. I got him right at the cusp of his mainstream explosion (you'll notice the enthusiasm in sharing his link from Kanye). In only a few weeks Christian would have a huge book deal, and be restricted from even conducting more interviews. The book would be rushed to print, and amidst throngs of media critics predicting a quick crash-and-burn would go on to be one of the smartest publishing "gambles" of the year, becoming a NY Times Bestseller. All of that, from blog conception to dudes taking "gonna show my mom" pics, happened in less than a year ('08).

Now in 2009, I thought I'd check in and see if Christian's postpartum depressed or riding high or just trucking along or what. So here we go:

The Assimilated Negro (TAN): So you've posted, like, four times in the new year. That's slower than me! Also, quite a contrast to your torrid pace to start the blog. What are we thinking: burn out? too busy? end of the SWPL road? something else?

Christian Lander (CL): Part of it is definitely a burn out. I try to make sure that the posts and the topics are still accurate and funny, I have no interest in updating just for the sake of updating. I also just finished the Page-a-Day Calendar which is actually a lot more work than it sounds like and leads to an enormous burnout on talking about white people.

TAN: So I see the tour ended a month or two ago: Much success? How many stops you make? Good consistent turnout?

CL: There were actually three tours- Summer 2008, Fall 2008, Winter 2009. I've lost track of how many cities were there, but I feel like I hit almost every big city in America except for New York (who knows why). Every stop had an amazing turnout and it stayed consistent the whole way through.

TAN: There was some backlash at the time of the deal, but I do feel SWPL has sustained as a go-to reference/standard if a writer/blogger is accessing that classification. i.e. when you need a link to describe white people. Thoughts on that? Will it be forgotten eventually or stick

CL: It would be great if it sticks, but I never in a million years expected it to become as popular as it has. So if it completely fades away, that's just fine with me.

TAN: any networking with your offshoots (stuff blacks/asians like ... etc.) any word on if any of those blogs turned to books?

CL: I have nothing to do with the off-shoots, Stuff Midwesterners Like was published and Stuff Christian's Like is also going into publication soon.

TAN: What's been a bigger deal for you: getting the money or developing the platform?

CL:It's been absolutely amazing to have developed the platform. I still can't get over the popularity and it's been so much fun. Not to sound too pretentious but it's been a lifelong dream to have a book on the New York Times Best Seller list, to have achieved that is just incredible and it still blows my mind.

TAN: Are you earning out your deal? Is that a concern? You hear stories about books being successes but the size of the deal becoming an albatross.

CL: The book is doing very well.

TAN: What's one thing you have learned from the experience, that you could not have anticipated?

CL: Hard to say, I don't think I had any expectations going into this so I'm not sure what has been a surprise. I think I just never anticipated how big it eventually became and it's still strange how often I meet someone and when they find out that I wrote the blog/book, they are impressed. That's still pretty weird.

TAN: Other projects, future plans etc?

CL: The book has been optioned by Imagine Entertainment to become a TV show and I'm working on that along with a few other TV projects that I'm really hoping will pan out. But immediately next is a talk show this summer with Microsoft and Crispin, Porter Bogusky. It's going to be on-line, so it won't be the biggest thing in the world, but it's going to be a lot of fun.

Thanks, Christian.

Previously:
Original SWPL Interview (pt. 1)
SWPL Interview (pt. 2)

Meet Larry Wilmore: Future Baron, Father to Black Paris Hilton

in case you missed it, we ran these outtakes from my interview with Larry Wilmore on Gawker over the weekend.

The original interview ran in support of Larry's book, I'd Rather We Got Casinos: And Other Black Thoughts, on The Daily Beast's book blog.

The hosting on gawker got messed up (that's what happens on the weekend), so I'm reposting here sans megaupload ads. it's a little small, but you can go peep on gawker if size matters.

cheers, enjoy!

TAN's House Of Hot-Ass Interviews

I like interviews. I'll be doing more and need an air-tight glass jar to keep them in...


The Roots: Part 1, Part 2 (on Gawker)

The Jeff Chang Interview: three part exchange on hip hop, Obama, post-racial identity politics.

The Sasha Grey Interview Experience: interview with 21-year old porn starlet and Soderbergh muse in The Girlfriend Experience. it gets messy.

Stuff White People Like Interview: I think I interviewed Christian Lander, the proprietor of SWPL, one day before his blog blew up to hefty six-figure astronomical proportions.
Post-Hype: Christian Lander... after the buzz.

Larry Wilmore: of The Daily Show, for The Daily Beast.

Read A Book: The satirical viral-video sensation ... for King-mag.

Daniel Radosh: in which I call Mr. Radosh one of the smartest caucasians i know.

Julius Lester: in which i do a nice grown up interview with a black-jewish renaissance man.

Dodgeball: don't have interview online, oops, will investigate... do have a song.

Lauren Williams, Stereohyped(RIP): editor of black jossip site, competition?

a 27 year old virgin: that's right fellas, a real life late-20 year old virgin... and cute too! start your engines!

the real live show: back in the days interview, they're a nyc based hip hop band and dope.

No Ebony Porn Section For This Guy: interview with a black guy who skips the ebony section on porn sites and feels bad about it. no really. kinda.

Email me if you should be on this list.

TAN Interviews Larry Wilmore

So I interviewed Larry Wilmore a week ago (maybe two now?), as he has a book out called "I'd Rather We Got Casinos and Other Black Thoughts" (here's his website). I love Larry's character on The Daily Show and he lived up to billing: very funny, razor sharp, and sort of intimidatingly fast with the jokes and humorous angle when hanging out with him in person.

I had a whole big interview with him on all sorts of stuff, and I previewed it with a clip of Larry and I talking Obama shop and The Daily Beast went and liked the preview so much they decided to run it as is. So here it is. With any luck we'll get to run some of the rest of it as outtakes or DVD-Blog extras or something.



At TDB they have an excerpt from the book as well.

In Search of Black Jesus [The Daily Beast]
I'd Rather We Got Casinos ...

The Chang Interview: Part 3. Advanced Hip Hop Diagnostics

Subject: Jeff Chang, author of Can't Stop Won't Stop -- a book (currently $6 on amazon? cop it now, yo.), and a website -- long and short, he's one of the contemporary Professors of Hip Hop.

Backstory: In the final verse of this three-part interview we compare the crises in Hip Hop and Wall Street, and explore how crack paved the way for our 44th President.

Mission: To sprinkle some crack on Barack. Let's do this:

(Part 1 of interview is here)
(Part 2 of interview is here)

PART 3: Hip Hop Diagnostics Check

TAN: In thinking about the "Wall Street is dead" headlines of late, the "hip hop is dead" headlines come to mind. did hip hop experience the same market correction? were some rappers living in houses their freestyles couldn't afford? has there been a hip hop recession? can an art or creative form experience those highs and lows?

Jeff: i love this analogy, and i think the similarities are shockingly crazy. i talk about this all the time, but usually get glazed-over eyes and yawns, but let me try again here and hopefully not put anyone to sleep.

the reason wall street is slumping with us right now is because deregulation got it all coked up. follow me here. deregulation made it feel omnipotent, made it feel beyond risk, made the irrational seem rational. and for a while, it got everything it wanted--risk-free money-making for the exclusive customer based off of predatory lending masked as humane housing policy.

when the media companies got deregulation, the same thing happened. it got big money rappers who could make money for them across multiple platforms (not just music, but vitamin water!) and sell to the big dark world beyond american borders (where most of the young world is urban and of color). it was risk-free chip stacking for the exclusive--the universals, the viacoms, the clear channels--masked as progressive, desegregated pop culture.

that's the thing about capitalism. supposedly it celebrates competition, diversity and creativity but it really wants monopoly, homogeneity and conformity.

and eventually monopoly, homogeneity and conformity destroy the whole farm.

think of another analogy--the move from self-sufficient farms to corporate farms. used to be everyone grew something different--crops, animals, whatever, and everyone traded and everyone lived. then someone figured out you could mass-produce corn. so the corn now creates soft drinks, feeds the chickens and pigs and cows, and turns your biodiversity into one big cornfield. pretty soon everyone's fucking obese and lazy or steroided and crazy. cause you gotta take steroids to get those muscles you no longer get from working the field.

i know you are reading this now and saying wtf?

my point is that it's not a correction, it's the way capitalism goes in the 21st century. wall street is now paying the cost, and corporate rap--because hip-hop is most certainly alive if you leave out corporate rap--is too. nothing's shocking anymore. fools in that game are either fat and lazy or steroided and crazy, and while that may be a good look for some, it's definitely not for most. it gets pretty boring for the average fan also, which is always the next source of renewal.

having painted this wall-e world, i do want to say that i'm the eternal optimist. maybe hard times will make folks hungry again.

and one last tangent: i guess in the end i feel about the hip-hop is dead argument the way i feel about all these anguished 'irony is dead' articles. isn't it ironic how much ironists want to believe irony is dead?

TAN: the "?uest love thesis" (as termed in your bloggingheads vid), puts crack/the crack trade in a more positive light. to my warped mind, your logic allows me to formulate this equation: the crack trade helps form hip hop ----> hip hop helps pave the way for Obama ---> therefore Obama has evolved from the crack game. An evolved Marion Barry? funny cause it's true? maybe?

Jeff: funny cause it's true enough. crack sucked, and musicians on crack still mostly suck. i also don't want to romanticize the relationship between hard times and art, because good art doesn't always come from hard times and hard times aren't a prerequisite for good art. i myself prefer not to be unhappy and i think most artists feel the same way.

but it's also true that lots of great art came from the environment that crack created. one version holds that more white people paid attention to hardcore rap because of the media blowup over crack. that may be true, but who cares? to argue that the artists back then were making music strictly for those who didn't live in cracked-out neighborhoods is to rewrite history backwards--say, from the clipse to n.w.a., not the other way around. you'd have to be an idiot or a serious narcissist to try to pull that one off. besides, when hasn't there been a mass hysteria in american society that didn't involve notions of illegality and darker shade of skin than pale?

TAN: I like the notion of gangster rappers as Republicans. care to expound?

Jeff: ah, young jeezy proved us wrong tho!

TAN: a big part of hip hop's multicultural cachet is really legitimized/propagated by the asian/asian-american embracing of it. I recently saw Ballerina Who Loves B-Boy, basically some asian breakdance crews doing an all-dance West Side Storyesque production. Can you enlighten as to what makes hip hop and asians get along so good?

Jeff: the same thing that makes hip-hop and everyone get along so good. not that it always enlightens us all. i was at r16, the international b-boy competition hosted by the south koreans, who simply dominate breaking now. i interviewed russia's top b-boy, this blonde-haired blue-eyed boy named robin, a nasty breaker with that bronx-style chip-on-the-shoulder, who cited how much folks like bob marley and nas had shaped him. then, in competition against the south korean crew called rivers, really the inheritors of the zulu kings legacy, robin made slant-eyes at c-4, one of the rivers crew's top dancers.

wtf? in front of a korean crowd? the russian kid was all balls and no brain.

still, and this is what i love about asians and hip-hop--this dude c-4 went back at him three times as hard, literally castrated robin and left dude with his tongue wagging. the crowd went bananas. now, i know from asians and pacific islanders having swag--i grew up on an island full of em--but hip-hop took us to a whole new level. and for that, we say thanks.

TAN: No, no Jeff. It is I who says thanks.

Seriously, thanks for the interview!

~Fin

The Chang Interview: Part 2. Et tu, Obama? Then Fall, Hip Hop!

Subject: Jeff Chang, author of Can't Stop Won't Stop -- a book (currently $6 on amazon? cop it now, yo.), and a website -- long and short, he's one of the contemporary Professors of Hip Hop.

Backstory: In part two of this three-part interview, we get into Obama and hip hop, and really the question that prompted me to get Jeff's opinion.

Mission: The two meatiest Q&A's in the interview are below. Let's peep the science:

(Part 1 of interview is here)
(Part 3 of interview is here)

PART 2: WILL OBAMA KILL HIP HOP???

TAN: I think this is the pea under my mattress that prompted all of this: in a recent slate article you used the phrase, “postracial-is-the-new-black.” It made me think, maybe Obama is the new hip hop...

Your book Can't Stop Won't Stop seems all the more relevant today, not because of hip hop, but because it's the story of our post-racial generation. In the current phrasing we’re swapping out hip hop semantics for new slang that's more inclusive/accessible.

Obama has personified this transition; the same way "hip hop" once served as a cultural uniter, Obama is now serving that role in a a more tangible way.

Looking back now, it seems hip hop, perhaps, had a certain misplaced ambition. In the 80s and 90s all we had was Hip Hop, so we needed it to be in politics and fashion and music and make cookies and do dishes and be transcendent. Now we know different. We can’t deny hip hop’s influence, but that no longer makes a given thing "hip hop" in that KRS-istential sense. Obama may brush the dirt off his shoulder, and show his love, but he's clearly not hip hop, right? He's bigger, badder, better.

All this makes me wonder: is hip hop still as relevant as it seemed to be, or at least aspired to be, a few years ago? if so, how? if not, didn't obama play a big role in killing it off?

Jeff: i think you're right on the mark in identifying right now as a moment in which everything is shifting. success--even partial success--always creates new tensions, new anxieties, new questions. obama is certainly a symbol of hip-hop's success in literally desegregating the popular culture. but without hip-hop, obama is unimaginable.

it's as simple as yz calling for 'a black president solution' back in 1989. i'm certain that against the backdrop of ronald reagan, nelson mandela, 'do the right thing', tawana brawley, and howard beach, he was imagining someone like a fela anikulapo-kuti/louis farrakhan figure--'black power's in the realm and the government's disagreeing'. now that we're in 2008, the first real black presidential candidate is, well, half white.

in a way, that's the difference between culture and politics. hip-hop is the art of the impossible. it imagined we could rule the world when we were clearly so far from actually doing so. politics is the art of the possible. democracy in theory reduces everything to the mean+1.

i'm as ambivalent about the idea of the 'post-racial' as you are, and not just because it denies an identity of blackness or brownness or yellowness--or an identity that sits somewhere between all of that--but it also denies an identity of whiteness. whiteness is an identity born of and linked to power, after all, and one that we thus have to understand as well.

hip-hop was the new black, and in that way, it created all kinds of avenues for people like me who aren't black to understand and value culture differently than it has been valued by society in the past. that, in turn, created ways of understanding what political power looks like in this country, and furthered desires to understand and value people and communities differently. so in the end, i'm for a movement whether in culture or politics that redistributes power, shares power, flips off authority and flips the given script.

if hip-hop would go back to being disadvantaged voices yelling loudly, that might solve the problem. but here's the problem--that's impossible now. too much has changed. the only realistic way forward is to admit that in some important ways we aren't the underdog anymore, that we fucking won. and then we have to get over our fear of 'what happens next'? what happens next is we take this shit over and run it.

TAN: A lot of your piece talks about the new multi-racial majority. reports have whites becoming minority in 2050. How do you see things changing once ethnics are running this piece?

Jeff: dude. now the census bureau says 2042. and the brookings institution says 18-29's hit that g-spot in 2028. 2028!!! i might even live that long.

so yeah, this is the big question now, right? this is where whiteness as the identity of power is crucial--i think of all the anti-black racism of my folks. it's pretty viscerally about both being higher up the food chain AND being lighter skinned. that, i think, was part of the real fear behind the 'is he black enough?' talk--but it was the Fear That Could Not Be Named, except perhaps by a cadre of folks who lived through COINTELPRO with a gun under their pillow. and generationally, some of us have been so eager to crash the party that those folks just sound really old. that's the flipside of 'post-racial' if you will.

the truth is probably somewhere in between--and my sympathies probably lie closer to the cadres than the david broders of the world, who are ready to call it a day for racism before driving home to their gated community.

lots of folks i spoke to this year, especially bun b and david banner, really wanted to emphasize that obama would be the president of america, not of non-white america, and that we needed to deal with that. which for me raised the obama and faith question. do we place our faith in him that he's gonna make things right? in this sense, 'yes we can' was a neat little rhetorical device--it allowed obama to wipe that dirt off his shoulder. it's not me, it's you. barack is getting ready to let us down easy. but then again, i truly buy his sincerity. i'm feeling that earnestness. after so many years of 'kick me please', it's nice to hear someone say, 'have it your way' and like really really mean it.

i guess my best hope is that the difficult conversations around race continue, that obama's presence puts a ceiling on the biliousness and the viciousness, and that the general arc gets pointed again in the direction of justice. as for the rest of it, i take his challenge seriously--if obama's in the office, then let's get it.

Saving the best for last in PART III: Which came first: The Death of Hip Hop or The Death of Wall Street... and, did crack pave the way for Barack?

image:
barack bigot

The Chang Interview: Part 1. The Brand Named Hip Hop

Subject: Jeff Chang, author of Can't Stop Won't Stop -- a book (currently $6 on amazon? cop it now, yo.), and a website -- long and short, he's one of the contemporary Professors of Hip Hop.

Backstory: I first came across Jeff at a sorta Jews-to-save-hip-hop panel at the 92nd St. YMCA. And he did the recent Obama cover story for Vibe. And is generally an Asian blazing the charts these days, so it was a nice opportunity to holler at him about the intersection of race, hip hop, identity politics in the wake of Obama.

Mission: Figure out what all this "postracial" business means for hip hop. He gave me plenty of fodder, so let's get into it:

~~

TAN (The Assimilated Negro): I recently went to a hip hop show with a writer from Gawker, he's a hip hop head. we talked some about the struggle for a writer who comes from that hip hop background but now speaks to an audience that doesn't appreciate it. so if he does something hip hop focused, and it gets no reaction-- without taking into account our inadequacies as writers-- is that indifference a product of hip hop's limitations? or people who are small minded? why is it so tough to get page views for substantive hip hop content?

Jeff (Jeff Chang): i don't know. i ponder this a lot when i'm writing or speaking on hip-hop and politics. the way i keep from going nuts is i tell myself i haven't found my audience yet. :) it's a serious question, but i think sometimes it's hard to tell what's the result of daily tides and what's the result of global warming, you know?

TAN: What do you think about the assimilation of hip hop into advertising? i.e. the abundance of white people rapping and such. The skills seem to be getting better -- people love this one for holiday inn express -- but it still feels exploitative. is it?

Stuff White People Like Interview: Part 2

Subject: The new blog sweeping the internets, Stuff White People Like.

Backstory: Launched barely a couple months ago, with a classic "why didn't i think of that?" model that creates a numbered list of satirical profiles on, well, on stuff that white people like. It's striking a chord and receiving shout-outs from everyone from the LA Times, to Kanye to Andrew Sullivan.

Mission: Being both a fan and practitioner of satire and poking fun at caucasians, I was interested in talking to the man deconstructing The Man. So herewith (a word I learned from white people!) is part 2 of my IM chat with Christian Lander, proprietor of Stuff White People Like.

(Part 1 is here. For Part 2 we disengaged from chat and converted to email Q&A.)


The Assimilated Negro (TAN): Any rhyme or reason to choosing your subjects/topics?

Stuff White People Like (SWPL): No. Basically, I just think of things I like, then I think of the things that people I went to school with like. If I imagine they would get psyched, it's a topic.

TAN: you think the aim/tone is more like "The Onion" or "wikipedia"? are you making jokes or seeking to inform? both?

SWPL: Both. In spite of the satire, I firmly believe that the tips offered are beneficial. If a robot were to follow the guide, I think they would fit in pretty well.

TAN: How many contributors do you have?

SWPL: 2 - me (clander) and my friend in Vancouver (Mylosh). Also 2 guest
columnists, Brian from Cats and Beer and Kristen Warner from the University of Texas.

TAN: Have you received a lot of caucasians looking to get on board or offering tips?

SWPL: YES. People are writing in more than I would have imagined. I read everything that comes through, but I don't have time to respond to all of them yet. Almost everybody gets where the site is going, and I'm getting some great tips. Usually, people are smart enough to send in tips for posts that are already in draft stage.

TAN: How long do you think this can go? Is there a finite amount of stuff white people like?

SWPL: White people are always finding new things to like. If we start to run out of ideas, we just go through individual films, books, and movies to create more granular knowledge. Although perhaps I will be excommunicated from the white community and I won't know what's going on anymore.

TAN: Do you think someone could do Stuff Black People Like, or Stuff Native Americans Would Like?

SWPL: Absolutely. So long as it's done in the right tone. My blog is not done to demean white people, it's meant to point out common experiences. I write about the things that I like, I'm implicated in all of this. So if someone were to start (and they have) a blog called Stuff Black People Like, so long as it's done to expose shared experiences, it should be fine. Of course, if it's done with malice or hate, it would be terrible.

TAN: Do you see any difference in response between whites and minorities/ethnics?

SWPL: not really sure. They are all email responses, so people could be lying. For the most part the response is positive from everyone. Most of the white people who write in are the ones being satirized, and they get the joke. The minorities who write in usually love the blog, they are also usually the first to go after white people who say that the blog is racist. The best response I've seen so far is someone who said, "there's a big difference, you haven't been denied a job because you like Yoga and Expensive Sandwiches." I think that put things into perspective pretty quickly.

TAN: The comments are pretty funny. Especially those that get their pants in a bunch. How do you feel about the commenters? Do you wish the PC police would go away? Do you think they all enhance the site?

SWPL: When I first started the site and we were getting a few comments, the angry ones hurt me. Especially the ones calling me racist. But I let them go, and watched as people stepped up to defend me and the blog. It was a good reminder that not everyone is going to get it, but the ones that do make it all worth it.

And in general, the comments are vital and essential to the site. I love seeing a mix of positivity and hate on there, people are talking, and that's always a good thing. Even if it's just on a ridiculous blog.

TAN: on comments, how about that the guy who does "stuffblackpeoplelike, stuffarabpeoplelike" ... do you hate that guy? is he on every post?

SWPL: Yeah. He wants to get a rise out of people.

TAN: Do you find a generational gap in terms of appreciating the humor, or people of all types enjoy?

SWPL: I think all generations seem to enjoy it. You see the original yuppies/baby boomers enjoying it, but I think it's certainly more popular with people in their 20s and 30s (aka the people the blog is about).

TAN: Who do white people endorse: Barack or Hillary?

SWPL: Barack. Post #8

TAN: How do you explain Bush? White people who love their prius, recycling, and being aware ... they can't like Bush, right?

SWPL: Bush was elected by the wrong kind of white people.

TAN: Whitest Movie of '07?

SWPL: Juno

TAN: Whitest Band?

SWPL: Vampire Weekend

TAN: you've mentioned mos def, probably one of your more spot-on posts, but he has nothing out musically right now. any hip hop group to recommend for white people?

SWPL: The Roots or Dead Prez

TAN: What's whiter: The Grammys or The Oscars?

SWPL: What the fuck are the Grammys?


Thanks Christian.

Stuff White People Like
SWPL Interview: Part 1
image via

Stuff White People Like Interview: Part 1

Subject: The new blog sweeping the internets, Stuff White People Like.

Backstory: Launched barely a couple months ago, with a classic "why didn't i think of that?" model that creates a numbered list of satirical profiles on, well, on stuff that white people like. It's striking a chord and receiving shout-outs from everyone from the LA Times, to Kanye to Andrew Sullivan.

Mission: Being both a fan and practitioner of satire and poking fun at caucasians, I was interested in talking to the man deconstructing The Man. So herewith (a word I learned from white people!) is part 1 of my IM chat with Christian Lander, proprietor of Stuff White People Like.


The Assimilated Negro (TAN): testing ... TA Negro here.

Stuff White People Like (SWPL): hey. TA Negro makes me think of Teaching Assistant Negro. that's cash money... I used to be TA Canadian.

TAN: nice, and now?

SWPL: I'm in LA now.

TAN: cool .... so i'm going to organize this in 3 parts: questions about 1. you, 2. the site, 3. more extra-credit fun[ny] type stuff.

SWPL: ok. I'll do my best. I'm at work so I might be a few minutes for responses etc. did you see this?

TAN: ha ... no. you are everywhere. I think i saw you mentioned in my supermarket circular

SWPL: don't say next to the mayonnaise ad or I'll end this interview right now

TAN: ha

SWPL: man, everyone wants a post on mayo. Undercover Brother was more powerful than we first thought

TAN: indeed. i did a post on the washcloth once .... and somewhat inexplicably some commenters turned the thread into a convo on mayo.

SWPL: that wash cloth thing. my friend K (who is black, from Louisiana) could not get enough. I was like "what's wrong with soap on skin" and she just laughed for like 30 minutes. I was like, I guess some girls use it for their face and stuff.

TAN: yeah, its kinda funny .... i don't use a washcloth, and do use mayo (assimilation!) and some people have been puzzled.

SWPL: ha. the wash cloth debate has probably been hampered by the explosion in shower gels and such.

TAN: maybe .. but I don't know, the key seemed to be whether 1. you felt you needed material to properly get the dirt off ... so soap, shower gel whatever. and 2. how much bacteria dirt the washcloth itself carries so how do you clean it ...

SWPL: washing machine. I think like towels.

TAN: so its not just gels, loofahs and other alternatives hamper the cloth also

SWPL: remember how Eddie Murphy got cleaned in Coming to America in that opening scene. that was pretty cool too.

TAN: ha. yeah

SWPL: [re. multiple washcloth use] I have the same questions about deep fryer oil like can you only use it once?

TAN: no way. i'm clueless in terms of cooking, but i feel in my black roots there's an implicit sense of cooking oil getting better every time you use it ...

SWPL: that's what I would think

TAN: i know people keep bacon grease and stuff to dabble in other things.

SWPL: because it seems like a waste to buy a ton of peanut oil to cook like 4 donuts. man, I've been so tempted to get a deep fryer for experiments but I know it would ruin me

TAN: ha. only white people would buy peanut oil to cook 4donuts. Or an experimental deep fryer...

sooo first and foremost, are you white? And ... who are you, what do you do?

SWPL: ok. I am white. here is another non surprise. there are pictures of me on the site. I'm the dude recycling. and the guy at dim sum. and the guy holding the iphone. and the bicycle picture is my bicycle.

TAN: ha.... SCOOP!

SWPL: I work here in Los Angeles as a Copywriter/Corporate Communications person.

TAN: how old are you?

SWPL: 29

TAN: How did SWPL get started? Take us through the moment of inspiration, white people love knowing that. Behind the Blog, DVD Extras etc.

SWPL: IM conversation. about The Wire. simple as that. my friend declared he didn't not value the opinions or trust anyone who did not watch The Wire. we said "they don't watch because they are too busy doing yoga" and it just spit balled from there. or snowballed. fuck it, it just grew from there.

I just said blog time and up it went.

TAN: do you consider yourself aligned with the white people you profile? You're white, but are you whom you describe/study?

SWPL: oh yes. this site pokes fun at ME. that's why I use pictures of myself. those aren't taken out of irony. this is the shit that I do. I need to call myself out for all of the stupid shit that I take for granted. why do I need $300 bike rims? why is a $10 sandwich considered normal?

TAN: When did you become self-conscious about your "whiteness"? When do you think the white liberal guilt kicks in? Is there an age? a rite of passage? do you need to see some black comedians talk about it? all of the above?

SWPL: Well remember a lot of the white people I'm lampooning (including myself) always can laugh at the comic view stuff because we're like "yeah, those OTHER white people, they are ridiculous." I grew up in Chinatown, in Toronto East Chinatown. a neighborhood bordered by a housing project, greektown, and little india. the neighborhood was always safe, but it's gentrified like crazy in the past ten years. but I would say growing up there made me aware of whiteness right away. I knew most chinese slurs for white people by age 10. but at the same time, I wasn't isolated. Toronto produces some pretty diverse crews of friends

TAN: do you think you need ethnic/minority friends to fully get the science on white people, or can a white person untainted by projects or chinatowns still come to these truths ...?

SWPL: I don't think you need minority friends to get the science. I think you just need to really like lumping people together in very specific groups. not necessarily by race. and that's a toronto thing because there are a ton of white guys who try to be chinese, indian guys who try to be jamaican, etc. ... and then different types of white guys like my friends would gather and think about what kind of things and activities white thugs/wiggers like. what kind of things do "garbage malvern guys" like (these are the dudes who like tevas, camping, skiing, etc).

TAN: huh. i know a lot of the posts seem honed in on white AMERICAN middle-upper class ... do you think its the same thing over in canada?

SWPL: yes. screw what canadians tell you. left wing americans are canadians. period ... actually I have a future post called "Threatening to move to Canada," white people love doing that shit!

Stuff White People Like interview continues: Part 2

Jewcy: TAN Interviews Julius Lester

I first discovered Julius Lester while in the midst of a James Baldwin moment.

Then I found out he had a blog, and felt compelled to share.

Now I've interviewed this black-jewish renaissance negro author-academic who's probably smarter than you for Jewcy.

Yay!

Lester had some interesting things to say about negroes and jews, and old[er] folks and new media. Here's the intro, followed by another photo from his portfolio:

As an assimilated negro, Black Jews just tickle my fancy. (Any girls out there who identify as a hybrid of Sarah Silverman and Oprah, call me!) I agree with the writer Julius Lester when he says, “What I find remarkable about Jews: They’re the only ethnic group that seems to care about blacks. At least Jews want to learn.”

I’ve certainly tried to learn a Jewish girl a thing or two on blacks, so I figured Julius Lester might have some words of wisdom for me. I first discovered Lester when I stumbled upon his must-read 1984 New York Times interview with James Baldwin (during which Baldwin exclaimed “Fuck Norman Mailer!” when Lester mentioned the author of “The White Negro”—sadly, the Times struck it from the record.) Besides being an academic and literary star—he's author of over 45 books and a decorated professor emeritus of UMass—Lester also happens to be that most intriguing of exotic birds, a Black Jew. He made a name for himself as a writer, radio commentator, and avowed atheist during the civil rights era, but converted to Judaism in 1982 after years of religious searching (Lovesong, his spiritual memoir, details this journey.)

At 68, Lester is still writing; next spring Harper Collins will publish his novel about lynching, told from the point of view of a 14-year-old white boy. I took to asking him some questions over e-mail...

“Our Lives Do Not Begin With Our Births” [Jewcy]

King-Mag: Read A Book Interview

Been sitting on this interview with the creators of the "Read A Book" video for a minute. Today it runs on King.

I sort of enjoy the King synergy of it all, because the bouncing "book-booties" were def. one of the video highlights, and the "not a magazine" skewering specifically used "Blaxim" as a mag-parody, and no one fits the "Blaxim" description better than King.

And of course King gets the joke, and heeds the message. Unlike some people. Just makes a nice synergy for the interview ... or so I dream while watching R Kelly again and again and again.

So yeah, Read A Book interview ...

(I got a lot more from them also, so might post a Part 2/addendum or something next week maybe.)

Book 'Em [King-Mag]
Read A Book [TAN]

TAN Q&A: Stereohyped Editor Lauren Williams

Earlier this week my usual routine of shucking-and-jiving for the man was interrupted by the announcement of a new blog for negroes called Stereohyped. "What's this" I thought, "someone trying to impinge on my TAN-turf? AND they've got gay white dollars behind them?!!?"

Needless to say I broke out the brass knuckles and prepared for serious beef (over email of course), cause I'm the only negro allowed to tapdance for gay white blog-publishers in this town dammit!

But then I finally scrolled down past the assimilated-inspired header, and noticed the editor was female, and cute. And the content was actually pretty interesting as well. Hmmph! I was at an impasse. Like the rest of the black community I'm programmed to hate on other negroes doing things I might be able to do if I gave up my forties-and-a-blunt daily multivitamin, so now what? Well as per my usual routine when flummoxed over an issue that has racial implications I watched about six hours of Oprah to get my mind right, and after a marathon of soaking in the big O's hip-hop-hating equanimity I decided that maybe black people could work together for a change. So instead of bullets and drama I sent over some questions (and a case of Colt 45) over to assimilated negress Lauren Williams. And 'gro-and-behold she was kind enough to respond:

Lauren Williams is a bit of a generic name. Can you spare us the trouble and tell us what an in depth Google search reveals about you? Particularly your credentials as a black person and a writer/journalist/tastemaker.

Well, I've been black for about 25 years, give or take a few in the mid-to-late 90s when I was having an intense Clueless/Britney Spears moment. I double majored in English and African American Studies (with an unofficial minor in institutionalized segregation on college campuses below the Mason-Dixon Line) at the University of Virginia, followed by a Master's in Magazine, Newspaper, and Online Journalism from Syracuse University. I worked as a local news reporter at a paper in Virginia for a year, which will go down in history as the most miserable year of my life. Then I fled to Paris to study cuisine at Le Cordon Bleu. Get it? Taste. Maker. The end.

How long has Stereohyped been in the works? Did it go through different iterations?

Stereohyped has been an idea for a couple of years, but I've only been working on it for a few months. I wouldn't say it's gone through different iterations, but it has definitely evolved and will continue to as I start to get reader feedback. Readers, feed back, please!

Who would you rather be with: Derek Jeter or Jay-Z?

The more important question to ask is who would rather be with me? Last time I checked, Derek Jeter prefers his milk without the chocolate, if you know what I mean. I don't like to get played, so the natural choice would be Jay-Z.
[ed. the idea is to choose between jock/model/athlete type vs. businessman/cool personality/rapper type]

You seem to cover everything black people love, EXCEPT sports. Where's the sports love? Are you aware that a lot of black people play sports?

Ugh, sports. It's an untapped gold mine, I know. The thing is, I don't know anything about sports beyond basic pop culture references. It would ring false. That said, I'm certainly not anti-sports. If someone wants to be my sports columnist, holla! Insert "for free" somewhere in there.

How involved were you in the name and design selections? What were some of the other names. And do you know a lot of black people who wear suits and brazenly carry spray paint cans around on their way to and from work?

The site already had a name when I started working on it, and I'm no designer. I did offer my opinion on the way things looked. Also, everyone I know carries spray cans on their way to and from work. And they're brazen with it. You need to get out more. But seriously, the logo symbolically represents Stereohyped's readers, who are educated but have diverse interests, who often have to act one way at their jobs and another when they go home, and who refuse to be pigeon-holed . Basically, it's for all of the Wall Streeters out there who have penchants for graffiti. And don't they all?

Who are your competitors? Are you stealing black readers from my friends at Gawker? Are you stealing white readers from my friends at okayplayer? You've got to be stealing from someone right?

I read so many blogs, and when I discover a new one I like, I just add it to the list. I'm not sure that there are any other blogs exactly like mine right now, so I can't name any direct competitors. I hope to attract readers who like gossip blogs, political blogs, sports blogs (just kidding), fashion blogs, etc. Basically, everyone should watch their back. Or at least be cool with sharing.

Speaking of white readers, are you keeping them in mind, or could you care less if they stay or if they go now?

I love white readers! However, if, by "keeping them in mind", you mean posting content just because I think white people will like it, then the answer is no. But I won't limit myself to posts that only interest black people. I'm not even sure that's possible. A lot of my content will interest a wide range of people. I welcome that, obviously. I'm not going to turn away or deliberately alienate readers.

How do you get your hair so deliciously curly?

Miss Jessie's Curly Pudding. Look it up.

Are you single?

Yes
[ed. Holla!]

Would you rather have: Jolie's lips, Biel's booty, Johannson's rack?

Jolie's lips are fine on her, but slapped on anyone else's face I think they would look more like Jack Nicholson in his Joker makeup than Lara Croft. Johannson's rack? I like mine better. I guess that leaves Biel's booty, which, I admit, is pretty impressive.

Do you interracially date/mate?

I never have before, but it's not something I would rule out.

Have you ever been called a nappy-headed hoe? Also, do you play basketball?

No to both. But once in high school gym class a white classmate asked me if black girls had to use special mascara because our hair was different. We were on the basketball court but were playing volleyball, I think. Does that count? A little?

Are you maintaining a rigid posting schedule? How much content can we expect?

At least 10 posts a day on the weekdays. A couple on the weekends. In other words, there will be more than enough procrastination fodder for the entire workday.

Was this your baby, or David Hauslaib's? If it was his, what in the world is he doing having a black baby? Does trent-is-the-new-pink know about this? If it's your baby, how did you convince The Man to be your black-baby daddy?

What in the world is he doing having a black baby? You really don't know? Black babies are all the rage. Ask Angelina and Madonna.

Should there be a blog for Asians, puerto ricans, and native americans? How about short people, or people who talk a lot in movies? How many niches should there be?

Why not? It's not for me to say how many niches there should be. Nobody's forcing people to read their blogs or making readers pay for the service. I'm pretty sure there are some bloggers who write just for themselves and consider readers an added bonus. Anyway, there is a small, odd, but loyal group of people who would religiously follow the People Who Talk A Lot In Movies Blog. I'm waiting for one geared toward people whose second toes are longer than their big toes. I might start that on the side.

Parting shots?

None.

Thick Interview: The Real Live Show

There will be a lot more hip hop content from me this year, and this is an old clip I thought I'd archive on TAN. It's an interview I did a few years ago (2004) with The Real Live Show for canadian hip hop mag Thick. Since it was an indie sort of outlet I angled towards exposing some of an indie band's process in getting their video some MTV exposure. The Real Live Show remains a must-see experience with world class musicians and performers, keep an eye out for their appearances.
(About Thick)

Please Listen to My Video
By [TAN]

There’s a Hip-Hop band rocking all the hot venues in NYC. They’ve been slowly but surely building a legion of fans. The group is The Real Live Show, and their days of anonymity may soon be over as the song ‘Shop Rocking’ is currently featured on MTV-U.

The video is animated and has a style and sound unlike anything else currently in rotation. According to Stimulus, Dionysos and Shelley Shick, the slick, ultra-stylized, innovative feature serves as a ‘calling card’ for The Real Live Show’s brand of funk and Hip-Hop flavour.

The Real Live Show core line-up: Stimulus - Vocals, Dionysos - Vocals, Tarus Mateen – Bass, Greg Hutchinson – Drums, Kim Thompson - drums, Raymond Angry – Keys, James Hurt - Keys, Thor Madsen – Guitar, Terreon Gully – Drums, Colt Seavers - Turntables

Thick: So was there any debate as to what song would be the subject for your first video?

Stimulus: No debate really. Whole process began with me meeting with some friends of mine in the business to talk about how we could collaborate on a serious project. One friend was a producer [redacted] (The Restaurant), one was a director [redacted] (Nappy Roots) , ‘Shop Rocking’ was our first joint that was mixed down and ready to go, so I presented it to them and they liked it.

Dionysos: It’s also the consensus favorite song. For the The Real Live Show our process was born out of an organic, jazz-like approach. In the beginning we couldn’t pay for musicians or studio time, so the band would play at the show and we would just drop whatever we had. But ‘Shop Rocking’ was a song Stim and I collaborated on from the start, our first song written together. We tried to sum up the struggle we were going through, and everything musically just kind of worked and translated so well. The song stuck

S: The song also features most of the musicians, as there are two types of bass, two types of keys…and musicians for each sound.

Shelley Shick: The song itself is a reflection of the overall Real Live process…it’s survival of the fittest with everything we do. We just give birth, and whatever people like wins.

T: It’s a very stylized video. How much of the direction/conception was you, and how much the director?

S: The initial idea was simply to visually demonstrate what The Real Live Show was about. Show the organic process we just discussed, and try to capture our live experience on camera. So, the plan was to basically present the musicians [and us] in different environments, within different vignettes.

We shot in April and the actual shooting was about five days. Three days for location scouting, two days for shooting…all the footage was taken in Brooklyn.

SS: It was our first time, and it was definitely a great experience. It’s just nice to do things you know are going to add serious points to your resume. We had a lot of people helping, rented a convertible CADDY…it was fun.

T: Did you and the director and producer split all the costs and production responsibilities?

S: Well, in terms of shooting, the director handled everything. We had no experience, and ultimately we did a lot of work in terms of getting the proper personnel around us so that when we were shooting we didn’t have to worry about production and direction stuff…we just had to be artists and have fun.

D: Basically at the start the producers produced a budget, explaining the process and what we needed. Very detailed, and they explained anything we didn’t know. But we financed everything. Stim actually had to work the 9-5 grind for a while to help pay the bills and get us started.

S: Yeah, waddup Ecko, good looking on the J-O!!

SS: What helped were people having enthusiasm about the project. Everyone was willing to go the extra mile, and you need that when you don’t have all the money in the world.

T: Was animation always a part of the plan?

S: Initially, it was just going to be regular film. But after final cut of raw footage, it wasn’t ready. It wasn’t grabbing me like it needed to. So we discussed the options, and the options were basically to spend a lot more money to treat the film in exotic ways. The big thing was called ‘FLASH’. It’s a film treatment that makes everything 100x more vivid. All pro videos you see on TV are treated with it, but we didn’t have the budget.

So, after some brainstorming sessions the director called some animators he knew…and it proceeded from there. Another three months after we made the call to go animation and we got the final cut. We liked it and it started getting real strong feedback from people we played it for.

T: So you have a hot video, did you just immediately say ‘let’s take it to MTV’?

S: Quddus – VJ ON TRL – has been to some of our shows, and knows us. We showed it to him, and he thought it was hot enough that he introduced us to the people who are on the review board.

D: MTV was surprisingly accessible. For a mighty music and media juggernaut you might expect some snobbery, or at least a lot of bureaucracy…but they were very cool, and we had a good amount of communication throughout the process.

T: What specifically did you have to do?

S: There’s an application you fill-out to be reviewed by the boards. It was a one-page form, very basic, primarily asking for the credits, and how often you want it played, and on what stations.

D: That was a no-brainer, of course we wanted it played 20x a day on every station.

S: We did leave off VH1…we felt they’re kind of old [laughs]

T: So just a form to get on MTV? Anything else?

S: You also had to include the video on beta SP, and a lyric sheet.

Eventually we had to submit multiple versions. After the initial copy, we had to make a clean version -- no foul language or drug references. Then after that we had to get it close captioned.

SS: And of course all these things cost money to get done and come with deadlines. After the first review, which took 2-3 weeks, they contact you and the process speeds up significantly…we had a week to resubmit the revised editions of the song. We were excited, but also feeling the pressure of getting everything done. If you plan something like this, be prepared for post-production issues and costs.

T: So after that, you were on to MTV?

S: Basically. After you get everything in they give you an initial air date and tell you where and when you’ll be in rotation. We got placed on the show ‘Freshman’, which spotlight new artists. The show is on five days a week at: 8:30am, 1:30pm, 5:30pm. It plays primarily on MTV-U, which goes to over 740 universities and colleges.

Part of the package was also space on the website, MTV.com. We had to build an artist page.

T: Last words?

S: The Real Live Show recently made history as the first Hip-Hop band to play at the Blue Note.

SS: …and look out for our LP, ‘Class is in Session’ distributed this fall…just in time for the back-to-school rush.

‘Shop Rocking’ on MTV.com -- www.mtv.com/bands/az/real_live_show/artist.jhtml

Check out The Real Live Show at: www.realliveshow.com

The Real Live Show [website]
Thick [website]